BlackFor30
Liberation is a philosophy that must first exist in our minds before manifesting through our actions.
BlackFor30
Finding Resilience and Pride in Identity w/Mawunyo Gbogbo
Ever grappled with the mispronunciation of your name or struggled to connect with your heritage? Join me as I host Mawunyo Gbogbo, a pop culture journalist at ABC and author of Hip-Hop & Hymns, who shares her inspiring journey of finding her identity as a black woman. Mawunyo opens up about the unique blend of resilience and pride she has cultivated while navigating challenges, including her quest to connect with her Ghanaian heritage.
We further peel back layers of her experiences as a black woman in Australia's media industry. She speaks candidly about encountering misconceptions, dealing with workplace racism, and the frustration of being seen as a disadvantage because of her race. More than just a window into her world, this episode offers profound insights on fostering understanding, dealing with adversity, and grounding oneself in one's values and beliefs.
Expect raw stories, piercing insights, and an unwavering testament to resilience and pride that promises to resonate with each listener.
Host:
Fungai Mutsiwa
Instagram: @ blackfor30
Guests:
Mawunyo Gbogbo
Instagram: @mawunyogbogbo
Website: Mawunyo Gbogbo
BlackFor30 is a place for exploring Pan-African theory and praxis through discourse. Send us your thoughts and questions @blackfor30 or via email at admin@blackfor30.com.
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I was in a shopping mall, this white dude, this older white dude, comes up and says when are you from? And I thought oh, you know, I'll just tell him now I'm from Ghana. You know what his answer was? Well, that's better than Nigeria or Sudan. I Was so disgusted. I was so disgusted with that response. I mean, how dare he? You?
Speaker 3:Was a connet do on both power catcher, which means Don't forget who you are or where you came from. Welcome to black for 30, what's up everybody, and welcome back to another episode, just as usual before we begin, if we can just take some time to focus and Settle in before we get to the conversation. Okay, welcome to this movement of consciousness that is black for 30.
Speaker 3:As we get into this conversation tonight, which is a Deep dive into the book, hip-hop and hymns, I like to start off by acknowledging that it's Been a privilege, you know, getting to know you through your book. You know it was because of, obviously, when we first met in person, it was at the event, right, and that was in a different Setting, you know, different context, but then having to then read your book and, you know, learn a bit about your life, it's been really interesting to See you from that angle. So I'm really excited to, like you know, explore Some of the themes and the experiences that you've gone through. With that being said, obviously People are wondering who I'm speaking to. Right now. I will let you introduce yourself.
Speaker 1:My name is Marnio Bobo and I am a pop culture journalist for ABC news and the author of hip-hop and hymns, which is my memoir exactly, and that's the book we're gonna be talking about tonight.
Speaker 3:So one of the things I realized a couple days ago is Something that we share in common is how our names are repeatedly mispronounced. I would assume, because I don't know about you, but I've heard a lot of mushroom jokes. I've heard a lot of fun guy jokes, and every noise seems to think that they're the very first person to come up with that. It's a bit of a frustration, but I've learned to deal with it now. Like, what does my new mean, though?
Speaker 1:Marnio actually means God is good.
Speaker 3:Oh, that's dope.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so it's got a nice meaning yeah, and. You know, in the past I have thought about Changing my name, but I really don't want to attempt, because you know what if God isn't so good to me? After that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and you know, I just remember it in your book you mentioned how your Parents decided to call you that, although you know they had gone through a. I guess they're going through like difficult motions within their relationship at that time, right, and so it was almost like a Almost, like iron in a way, or I guess maybe speaking a manifestation, right.
Speaker 1:And and how they chose to name you Marnio well, it was my mom's decision tonight me money and and she there were a couple of reasons. She named me that one. You know she believes God is good, she's a Christian she's a very strong Christian, as you read about in hip-hop and hymns and and she wanted to express her faith by naming me that. And she also thought that you know, she didn't know she was gonna raise me in Australia, hmm, so she was telling me. I said why, why not? Would you name me Marnio, like such an unpronounceable name? And she said Well, kids in Ghana who were named Stephen Smith or Robert Jones, they got.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you know, it's just all about.
Speaker 1:She didn't want me to get, she made me a traditional guy name name. Yeah, that was one reason. And the other reason Was to do with the fact that I was actually named after someone. I was named after a girl called Marnio, who mom said was Really really successful but also very, very naughty. And I said to her like, this is a woman who is from a faith where, and and the country where some of the beliefs are that you take on the characteristics of who you're named after. And I was saying to her why on earth would you name me after someone who was really, really naughty?
Speaker 3:And she said I wanted you to have character nice and and that you definitely have, and we'll get to explore that.
Speaker 3:As you know, we talk about your book and the first thing I want to touch on is the poem from Dorothy note that you quoted and you were talking about how she says you know, they may not remember you off what you said or what you've done, but it's by how you made them feel. You know, and Taking into account, you know, as I read through your book, all those, the things that you went through, all your experiences, right, you know, trying to fit into the Australian culture, having moved from, from Ghana. You know, trying to Find your identity. You know, as a black woman, when you are listening to hip-hop, which you know, as we know, promotes misogyny in in in some cases, right, and then you also had your time in America. You went through discovering love and you know, finally graduating. So what feeling or feelings Describe that? You know that that journey for you, like, if you were to, I guess, like, try Sum it up, what would you say?
Speaker 1:Sum up the whole book.
Speaker 3:No, not the book, as in your journey, just like from an emotional perspective when you get to retrospectively look at all of what you've gone.
Speaker 1:So I think that a word or a sentence that I would use to sum up my journey would be Resilience is the first word that comes to mind. But if I was to do it in a sentence, I would say something along the lines of Wow, never thought it would turn out like that, I don't know like, because when I was putting my book together, the thing that I found is everything that happened throughout my story led to other things that happened in the story. So, you know, something that happened ages ago that I thought was pretty insignificant impacted stuff that happened later on down the track. So an example of that would be when I was in high school I was studying drama and I was doing a poem by Langston Hughes and I was an avid reader of the source back then, the source magazine, and I read in the source that the lady of rage had performed the same poem that I was going to perform for my high school performance. And what I did was I looked at the byline on the story and rang the United States, you know, on my parents landline rang the United States, so that I could speak to the journalist who wrote that story to ask him a little bit more about this performance by the lady of rage. I was a high school kid doing this.
Speaker 1:Anyway, fast forward. Maybe 20 years later I'm in New York City. I see the same journalist on television. He's being interviewed about hip hop. He's now the executive editor of the source. Back then he was a contributor and I thought, oh, I've got to pay this guy a visit. And so I did and I ended up interning at the source magazine. So you know, like everything you know kind of comes around and you know it doesn't make sense that I called the United States in the 1990s about the lady of rage. It was an outrageous thing to do, right, but it paid dividends.
Speaker 3:20 years later, yeah, I mean I definitely love the initiative, though you know, not a lot of people even today would do that right. So I thought that was really dope. And I guess there's that element also where you know it's not luck right, because you're creating that opportunity for yourself, and then it panned out. And you know so here's where you are now.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you make your own luck. It's for absolute sure.
Speaker 3:So, like one of the themes that sort of soar as common in your book I'd love to touch on is the microaggressions that you experience. Right, because obviously you know you grew up in Musselberg, so it's, like you know, regional New South Wales for people who are not aware where Musselberg is and you share about your moments from you know. You talk about your skin right and how you had a girl at school who asked you how long it would take until you became white. You know you had some dude yanking your hair in the bus when you're going back home from school. You know, and sadly you know, these are not unique experiences as black people. So what would you say those experiences? Right, you've had it and you obviously mentioned several others within the book. What would you say those experiences have done in as far as your dignity and your relationship with your image?
Speaker 1:Well, I think the microaggressions have had, you know, less of an effect than the outright racism I've experienced and also the racism that's hidden. But that's the worst type of racism really, when you can't get a certain job because of the color of your skin and you can't pinpoint it, but then you know, a boss tells you that hey, you know, you didn't get that job because you're black and they're only really hiring white people for television.
Speaker 3:So you know this is kind of hard to hear which is literally what happened to me.
Speaker 1:So I think that type of racism is worse because it affects the trajectory of your career, like it affects everything, and microaggressions are irritating, they're annoying and they are a big deal. But I think it's a bigger deal when someone calls you the n-word repeatedly in class and you're forced to sit next to this guy Another thing that I wrote about you know, those experiences, I think, had more of an impact on my state of being than the microaggressions, to be honest.
Speaker 3:And that's definitely fair to say. You know, you mentioned that subtle racism, right, that implicit racism. I was laughing about this with my friend the other day that it's almost like they leave it for you to figure out, so they won't come out and say it explicitly, it's just there and like it's just a feeling that you didn't carry, and sometimes part of it also, I think. At least personally, I'll say you're not sure whether it was actually something that was racist or not, right, and so these are all things that you would then having to go through and they just sit in your head and the other person just well goes about their merry life, right?
Speaker 1:Yeah, like I mean, when you sit in a meeting at work and you look around and there are at least 15 other people in this meeting and not one of them other than you is black, not one of them is even a person of color when you're thinking, how did this happen? And you know, stuff like that doesn't happen by accident. People are employing people who look like them, people they can relate to on that level, and when you go through these workplaces it's just you think, wow, you know you guys really set up this place for yourselves and yourselves only, and you know you let people like me occasionally treat us like shit so that we'll leave or whatever. You know it's tough, but at the end of the day, you know what can you do. What can you do? But continue to be the best, work harder than everybody else and try to succeed and try and bring people who look like you up with you as you do that, you know.
Speaker 3:I think it presses the fact that it's harder to try to convince other people that, hey, you know, just treat me as an equal. It then leaves the onus on us to try to create those spaces for ourselves. Of course it'll be hard, but you know it's that. Or waiting until other people are ready, you know, and who knows when that's ever going to be. You know there are two observations I've made.
Speaker 3:So I've been in Australia since 2010 as I moved here, so I was about 20. And you know, along the way I've sort of picked up how they are two, not two types of Africans, but there are two types of ways of seeing Africans raised in Australia. So you find that when families or African families migrate to Australia, the parents are generally not prepared to help their children navigate the cultural differences and this is no judgment, you know, this is merely just an observation, right, and I see that it tends to result in kids facing difficulties with understanding the roots of their identity. You know we and with that we're often asked this question of where are you from? Right, and I know that lands differently depending on which black person you ask, especially here in Australia. So you know when you hear that question how do you define home?
Speaker 1:Well, when I hear that question, first of all, depending on who's asking me that question, I get my backup almost immediately when it's not someone who looks like me, so if it's not a brother or sister, you know who's genuinely curious, wanting to know whether we're from the same country or whatever. I often do get my backup with that question because of the intention behind it at times, because I get asked that question almost every single day of my life and you can imagine just how exhausting and how irritating it can get to be asked that question. And often it's a white person asking me that question and often they don't know anything about Ghana anyway, or Africa generally at all, and they're just curious. And sometimes I mess with them, you know, like I'll say muscle broke, because that's where I'm from, really that's where I grew up. But then occasionally I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and whenever I do that and I say Ghana, then they, their true colors, come to pass.
Speaker 1:For example, I was in a shopping mall minding my own business. It was at Coles, actually. I was just shopping at Coles and this white dude, this older white dude, comes up and says where are you from? And I thought, oh, you know, I'll just tell him. You know I'm from Ghana. You know what his answer was Well, that's better than Nigeria or Sudan. I was so disgusted. I was so disgusted with that response. I mean, how dare he?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think, going back to what we would mention earlier as well, that's one of those frustrating things about the interactions we have on a daily basis, right, because sometimes you find there are people who are genuinely curious because Australia is far from a lot of places, right, and a lot of people who were born here don't necessarily travel.
Speaker 3:Like I had a conversation with a dude I used to work with, right, and I really appreciate it because, like he came out and he was like dude, like sometimes it's difficult, so he's white Australian, and it was like sometimes it's difficult to talk to a black person because you know you're afraid that if you ask something genuinely and you offend, then you know, then it creates tension, but in some cases, so you didn't have to figure out. I guess you know it is really based on each interaction that you have and the particular person right, where you can find someone who is like that old man that you met at the supermarket. Or you could meet someone like my dude right, where I could genuinely tell that he's curious and he wants to know about Zimbabwe and you know, about the general black experience within the context of Australia. I guess it's, you know, in some ways it's like walking the walking, a fine line.
Speaker 1:Well, I guess I'm so cynical about it because in November this year that will mark 40 years that I've been in this country. So at what point will I be considered Australian? At what point, after 40 years in this country, I've been in here so much longer than I spent in Ghana, Like, like it's not, like I was just a toddler when we left Ghana and it's like, well, at what point are you going to actually consider me Australian?
Speaker 3:I mean realistically speaking. When you become white? Probably Exactly.
Speaker 1:Like the girl was saying, you know when, how long will it take before you turn white?
Speaker 3:Because I mean like Aboriginals, have been here since day one, right, and I remember when I first moved here and some dude went on Red Fern and we're drinking and some guy was just talking about how he was basically questioning the, I guess, the Australian hood, australian-ness of the Indigenous people, you know, which I thought was crazy. But yeah you know, and being in Sydney right, we engage with Australian culture every day, of course, so how do you connect with the Ghanaian side of you?
Speaker 1:So I would say the answer to that is not very well, and not frequently, and just not as often as I would like to. And how do I connect to the Ghanaian side of me? Well, I don't Really Because. So here's the thing you were talking earlier about how our parents some parents basically don't really guide their children through finding their identity and that sort of thing, and that was the case with my parents. They were too busy dealing with their own stuff in Musselbrook to really sit down and teach us who we were really.
Speaker 1:You know like I had to find out certain things much, much later on. That came as a surprise to me. You know things about my history that came as a surprise to me because my parents didn't teach me that sort of stuff and we didn't have the internet when I was a kid, certainly not in our house, and so you know you couldn't just hop onto Google and find these things out in a matter of seconds. We had encyclopedias. My parents were very good at buying encyclopedias, but you know I can't read them occasionally. But you're not going to sit there and read, you know rings of encyclopedias.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, I just have found a lot of stuff out later on on my own. And when it comes to connecting with my community, I mean I've got friends who are of Ghanaian descent and who I hang out with, but you know, I can count them on one hand. Like I've got a lot of friends, very few of them are Ghanaian. I used to go to a Ghanaian church. Well, it was a church that had a very Ghanaian congregation, but you know, I've moved away from that area and haven't been going there. And so, yeah, like I, you know, like I connect a lot with other black people, you know there are a lot of people within my friendship circles and really really close friends, who are black. They just don't happen to be of Ghanaian descent. So, yeah, I would say that I have researched my past, as in my country's past and that sort of thing and I mean that's how I connect with being Ghanaian is to read about people like Kwame and Krumo and stuff like that.
Speaker 3:Really, yeah, it's unfortunate, but I mean, I guess and I almost want to say that I don't think you're alone in that experience. As well, there's a lot of us who are unable to find ways to tie us back to our culture. For me, something that's been recent is music, actually, and I'm really enjoying the space that I'm in now where I'm actively looking for music. So it started with the Desert Blues, which is this genre. I think it's in the West Africa region, so I think it's west and north maybe, and so it's like this fusion of jazz blues with guitar dope sound, and I was like yo, why does it take me to 33 years to find this sound? I've never listened to any of this music before. And then I started to look for more music like that and I started to discover more artists and I'm really enjoying that sound. But then that also then took me back to Zimbabwe music.
Speaker 3:So we have this instrument called Embida, which is our version of a piano, and it was seen as so. Growing up it was seen as something that is less sophisticated in the realm of art. So we would find ourselves listening more to European music or American music and we would shun our own music. So growing up I never really appreciated my own music that much, but then now, when I'm older, I'm actively looking for these artists.
Speaker 3:And it's so dope when you're hearing, because we're storytellers Africans, we're generally storytellers so as I'm listening to this music, I am also then getting an insight into my culture, and that's something that I'm enjoying and I'm finding also because we're so far from home right. We have to actively look for ways that give us that sense or that feeling or that connection. One of the things I've picked up on as well along the way is I read and learn a few things is how, as black people, were not afforded this luxury of being seen as individuals and this is both by black people and non-black people. So for the most part, we're either subject to profiling or group think. Either one holds the expectation that we conform to think and behave in a certain way. So when you think of it, what's your identity grounded in?
Speaker 1:It's grounded in my face, it's grounded in my knowledge of self. So I know myself really bloody well by now. I can't know myself really, really well, and that's actually taken a lot of work, to be honest, like being in therapy a couple of times a week at one point and really getting to know myself on an intimate level. And I did that because there was a time where I really didn't know myself. I really didn't know myself, and I know myself so well now that nobody can tell me something and I'm going to believe it. Like you know, like I know, I'm a good person. I know I mean well, I don't always do the right thing, like most people, no one does yeah.
Speaker 1:So I guess my identity is grounded in the fact that I'm a woman of faith and I know myself and it's yeah. I mean, I guess that's a really hard question, to be honest. Like, I feel like my book is about identity, but that's one of the key themes in hip hop and hymns is identity, because I'm figuring it all out, it's a coming of age story and for a lot of that book I'm quite lost. No, I don't know who I am and you know it's taken a lot of work to get to the point where I'm really comfortable in myself and yeah, you know.
Speaker 3:so I remember someone said you know, we don't change, we evolve. And that's what I see identity as my ex-boyfriend. Yes.
Speaker 1:Are you talking about in the book here? My ex.
Speaker 3:I was like I heard that somewhere. Yes, so that's from your book. Crazy. But yeah, you know, and it was really interesting, right, because that's how I see identity. You know, it's not something that's static. We continue learning about ourselves and as we learn about ourselves, you know, parts of us change, right, and it's really clear in your book as well. And you know, I've gone through my own experiences off that as well.
Speaker 1:Even as a high school kid, I was so innocent you know, I didn't kiss anyone until I was 16, which is unheard of and that's when I was listening to the most hip hop really was when I was 15, 16, 17. Like, I was listening to a lot of hip hop and I was taking in all these messages and my life was reflecting what I was hearing about on my CDs or tapes at the time and, yeah, like that to me was my identity and it took a lot of work to break free from that, to break out of that.
Speaker 3:You know there's a part in your book when you speak a lot about that and it brought two songs to mind for me Inla Tifa, you and I TY Dope dope song and Lupe Fiasco's Bitch Bad. I love Bitch Bad.
Speaker 1:Oh my goodness, yes, bitch Bad. When I first heard that song, I thought, oh my God, he's describing me right now, that little girl who's on the computer, who sees the video clip of her favorite artist talking about this bitch bad, this bitch bad, bitch bad. And I like myself a good, bad bitch. I want a bad bitch, and then the video girl being a bad bitch and then me thinking, oh yeah, I'm a bad bitch.
Speaker 3:That's what I want to end with.
Speaker 1:And I'm like good on you, Lupe, you've got this. Oh my God, this is like V songs. Yeah, you know there are a lot of songs that encapsulate my book, but that's one of them.
Speaker 3:It definitely presses also the importance, I think, around. You know we have to acknowledge that it's two ways Is, decide where the odd is should at the very least be aware of the responsibility, of their influence, right, how they choose to act though you know I'm not one to dictate that. And then this other side where, as the audience, now more than ever, I think it really begs us to have accountability as well, like where we're a lot more conscious, I think it's all about the audience having accountability.
Speaker 1:Like I'm not saying that certain artists shouldn't exist or shouldn't talk a certain way or shouldn't talk about their own lived experience or whatever, no way Like go ahead, do you?
Speaker 1:But then me as an audience like listening to that. I think there needs to be education and that's one of the reasons why I think hip hop and hymns should be in schools, like not for the little kids because it will totally freak them out and it's a little bit too X rated for that, but it should be in high schools for the year 11 and year 12 kids, because I wish I had a book like hip hop and hymns when I was in year 10 or year 11 or year 12. You know it would have explained so much to me and I would have, you know, it would have helped a lot because I was such a confused teenager listening to this music and taking in these messages and having parents who were doing their own thing and not even realizing that I was listening to Lil Kim, you know, like 16, 17 year old listening to Lil Kim. My parents had no idea, and so books like hip hop and hymns can, you know, help kids a little bit.
Speaker 3:Contextualize that.
Speaker 1:Figure things out, contextualize this sort of thing, I think. Yeah.
Speaker 3:You know, one of the things that stick out in your book as well is, like you know, you're clearly passionate about storytelling. From a young age, you know reading being inquisitive, writing poetry and short stories. So we generally have a vision of you know who we want to be when we grow up, right, and then as we get older, we watch that unfold. So within that, we experience barriers when we actually see what reality is like. All right, so what have you found you know to be challenging in your pursuit of your career and how have you navigated that, especially for people who would, because I know a few people who are interested in getting into media, for example. So, yeah, could you share a bit on that?
Speaker 1:For me personally, it's been a long, hard road and in terms of where I thought I would be and where I am now. So when I first started in media, I was bright-eyed and bushy-tailed and thought the world was my oyster. I thought being black would be an advantage, an actual advantage, because there weren't any black people on television, anyone from an African background, and I thought that, you know, workplaces would value someone a little bit different to what they had, someone different from their usual offerings, and I thought that it would be a good thing. So my cousin recently reminded me of a conversation we had Now she is Lebanese, so she married into our family, and she was saying to me do you remember when I asked you what you wanted to do for a living, you told me you wanted to be, you know, a reporter on 60 Minutes.
Speaker 1:And I said to you do you think Australia is ready for that? And your response do you remember what your response was? And I'm like, yeah, like I actually do remember that my response was well, why wouldn't they be? This was probably 15 years ago, 15, 20 years ago and 20 years later, they probably still are.
Speaker 1:Like I was so sure that being black was not going to be a disadvantage in any way, but it has been. For me personally in my career, it's been a huge disadvantage. And now things are changing. Things are changing in that workplaces actually do want people who look like us now, and the advice that I would have for people wanting to get into the biz would be to take advantage of that. But also, do your work like, do your groundwork, research the organization, work hard. You will still have to work harder than your white colleagues, because the way it is now is that people are being thrown in the deep end to either sink or swim, and if they don't swim, then they're kicked out. And what you were saying earlier about all of us being tired with the same brush it's like it'll take another 20 years for the next person to get an opportunity.
Speaker 3:It's ridiculous Same way of thinking but in a completely different context. But it's like when I would hook up or date a chick from another race or even another country and then they would say I'm not going to date any more Africans. So for you working obviously you've worked behind the scenes in media, so you've seen behaviors from coworkers at that, reinforced racism which you earlier spoke to, also misrepresentation, underrepresentation and that's of black women or just Africans in general. And in your book you also mentioned how you worked in radio and you had this particular day where you were taking in calls and you just received oh, that wasn't a day.
Speaker 1:That was two years.
Speaker 3:Oh, two years, two years worth of that.
Speaker 1:So you understand now why I'm so jaded. That was two years of listening to that, twice a week, every week.
Speaker 3:And for everybody else who hasn't read your book yet, can you just share a bit in terms of what the experience was when you're interacting with the audience?
Speaker 1:Sure, and actually it was three times a week, so Friday morning, saturday morning and Sunday mornings. I was a producer on an overnight program, so a late night program on the radio, and people would call in from right around the country to. You know there were talk back callers, they wanted to be on air and they would call in to chat about whatever we were talking about on air and sometimes, you know, I'd put them to air, sometimes I wouldn't, but every time we did a topic that had even a little bit to do with race, like if there was race involved in at all, or it was about a black person or whatever these people would say the most racist stuff and I would be like, on the front line, right, I was the first person to pick up the call so I would hear what these people had to say and you know it was freaking, traumatizing.
Speaker 3:It's sad sometimes when you think about it, right, that part of the human experiences. We like to categorize things, you know, we see things in right versus wrong, good versus bad, white versus black, male versus female, and we get so strung up on these categories that we create, you know, and really all they are are just social constructs so we can understand how to navigate the world that we're in. But it doesn't mean that anyone is better, you know. It just means that we're different. It's just sad that. You know.
Speaker 3:It's hard for a lot of people to just grasp that simple fact. You know it. And when I look back at just you know, our experiences and I say our as just black people, you know, from history up until present day, it's like we go through these shitty experiences and a big part of it is because of a group of people who are so insecure in who they are and that they choose to believe in this superiority complex that they are better than the next person or you know they're better than black people. But the funny thing about that complex is it heavily relies on the other person believing that they are of lesser value. Right, and it also says a lot about yourself if you need to put someone else down in order for you to feel as if you are of any worth.
Speaker 3:So we get tricked into thinking that we are the ones that are lesser than right. But the way I kind of see it is actually the other way around, because if I'm so grounded you know, you'd mentioned this earlier If I'm so grounded in who I am and become so comfortable in my own skin you know, literally and figuratively, if I am then I will not be shaken or moved by your opinion of me. Okay, I can't stop you from sharing your opinion about me, sure, but then what I have control over is how I then choose to react. So you can say whatever you want about me, but as long as it doesn't register anywhere on my radar, then I'm not phased.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that's so cool when you get to a point where you don't care about what people think of you. Like you don't care about what people think. Basically, Like you know, you know yourself, you've got your loved ones, you've got your group of friends who think you're cool and you're good with that, and if someone doesn't like you for whatever reason, it's like, oh well.
Speaker 3:That's a you problem, that's a you problem.
Speaker 1:That's right. That's right, yeah.
Speaker 3:Well, this has been really dope. I'm going to chat about your book for whoever is listening, go out, buy it, read it, listen to it and, yeah, like it's always cool to you know, see, see yourself and other people. Sometimes you don't, you don't actually see yourself, but then it's just also just getting to see the other side of what life is like and that's what broadens our perspectives, right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's right, and that's what I hip. Hop and hymns is a great book for not just people in our community, who is who I wrote it for. You know, it's a good one for anybody really, to sort of just to get another perspective and to learn a little bit about somebody else's life and the people I encountered along the way.
Speaker 3:That now I have the privilege of also knowing. So this has been dope. Thank you so much for your time. Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts and to everyone else that's listening, thank you for pressing play and remember stay black. I hope this was a learning experience to adopt and change the way you think and live. The goal is for us and that includes you to be able to see ourselves for who we are, so we can accept the person in the mirror and begin to value ourselves. Whether you agreed, opposed or offended by some of the content, I encourage you to engage with me so we can have positive discussions and try to understand each other. So send your comments, reviews or feedback to our Instagram, blackfor30, or an email to admin at blackfor30.com. If you believe someone will benefit from this episode, please show it when you get to the end of this recording. Please subscribe to blackfor30 wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you for your time and I wish for you to join me again.
